From: Diva Las Vegas organizers (dlvorg@geekbabe.com)
Date: Thu Jul 30 2009 - 09:18:56 CDT
In this mailing:
Org List
Winding down the date selection
Comments on golf & SO gathering
SO lunch and ideas
Activity discussion
Activity and venue suggestions
Administrivia
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Org List:
This is the DLV 2010 Organizational Mailing List (dlvorg@geekbabe.com)
Replies to this message will be forwarded to the DLVORG list and not
the DLV-Announce or DLV-Discuss list.
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Winding down the date selection:
No further discussion has come in so far regarding the
dates of DLV 2010. Last call!
If we don't have any signficant date items come in the
next 24 hours, we'll go directly to a Call for Votes.
(If you're of voting status, watch your inbox, please.)
Important:
THIS IS LAST CALL FOR ANY PERSONAL CONFLICTS
WITH ANY OF THE NOMINATED DATES! If you are an
active volunteer and you know you will have difficulty
with any of the nominated dates, this need to be brought
up now, not after the timeframe has been voted upon.
. . .
There will be two measures to be voted on, both will appear
on the ballot.
Here's what we currently have in nomination:
Ballot measure 1, the calendar week of the event:
Options (in order of nomination):
1. Within the week beginning April 18. (Nominated,
multiple seconds.)
2. Within the week beginning March 14. (Nominated,
pending second.) This will be dropped if no second
is received by Call For Votes time. (LAST CALL!)
3. Within the week beginning March 21. (Nominated,
seconded.)
. . . . .
Ballot measure 2, length of the event and start/stop days:
Options (in order of nomination):
1. Six-day. Begin Sunday, end Friday. (Nominated,
multiple seconds.)
2. Seven-day. Begin Sunday, end Saturday. (Nominated,
multiple seconds.)
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Comments on golf & SO gathering:
Bob writes (first-person, no quoting):
It's a shame that Edy & Mardi had no control over the high temps
that were predicted for the golf tournament.
I planned the SO gathering with the thought in mind that I am a
rarity in DLV, a male SO. I was apprehensive as to how I would
be received. My friend Coli from Utah, who I see about 4 times
a year had nothing to do that day, so I invited her to come with.
Then it turned out that my SO Susan also had nothing to do, so
I invited her too.
Susan gave me some incite by reminding me that virtually everyone
that comes to DLV not only has, but is a SO.
I was expecting some questions about being a male SO, which never
happened.
I felt like I was one of the "gang" at all times. I sincerely
hope that no one there took offense by having Susan or Coli there.
As far as I'm concerned any SO is welcome to a SO gathering.
In 2010, I am planning on having more the one SO gathering,
possibly for more than just lunch. How about a short hike (approx.
3/4 mile.) then having lunch?
A walk on the strip?
A picnic in the park?
A BBQ?
I'm sure I'll think of something & if any SO's have a suggestion,
i will surely listen.
. . . . .
Thanks, Bob.
Comments on any of this will be welcome from all, regardless
of SO status.
There may be some disagreement as to who is and is not a
"SO", WRT attending "SO activities" as part of DLV.
You and Susan do bring up a very good point, that being that
the majority of our attendees have a SO and are a SO.
The definition of "SO" as used in the TG community has
historically been very narrow, but has been broadening
over the past decade or so.
We at DLV have always had a more inclusive definition of what
is a SO than is typically seen with other TG groups. If you
will pardon my digression here, we can visualize a spectrum
of what could or could not be considered a SO from the most
traditional, to the most inclusive, as follows:
1. The traditional cisgendered genetic female partner of a
nontransitioned genetic male CD or TG. (SPICE definition.)
2. The genetic female partner of a M->F who has transitioned
or is in transition.
3. The cisgendered genetic male partner of a M->F TG.
4. Both members of a TG-TG couple.
5. The TG partner of an attending SO outlined in 1, 2, 3.
6. The TG partner whose SO is not present at DLV.
7. The TG who formerly had a SO.
8. The TG who is a potential SO.
DLV's definition of SO has always included classes 1 thru 3
and possibly 4. Our first well-attended SO gathering was in
2002 and it was explicitly noted that male SOs were welcome.
We've had male SOs in attendance each year since 2001. This
year I counted at least three.
It appears that Bob has included 5 and 6, possibly 7, in
those who attended the 2009 gathering.
I'm not saying that's a bad thing. I've always said, and our
standing rules state that the coordinator of record is the
one who makes the call as to who and who is not welcome at
a particular activity.
I would think that the others were more "surprised" than
"offended" at seeing Susan and Coli there.
However, I most definitely got the impression from two of
the comments in feedback that some SOs were most definitely
expecting a more exclusive definition of SO, limited to
1-3 above and possibly expecting only those in 1-2.
+Hope the SO get-together coordinator is rotated each year,
+to get different views.
Bob, I hope you don't take that one personally. I interpret
that remark to indicate that the respondee was definitely
expecting more of a "traditional" gathering of SOs, was
surprised at the diversity, and may have expected to be more
comfortable with such more exclusive group.
Different views???!! WTF? IMAO, you get "different views"
with a nontraditional SO running the thing and a more
incusive group of participants.
Anyway, I think the following comment reflects the surprise
at finding more of a diverse group at the SO gathering.
+I suggest that the SO luncheon be for the SO's only. Most of
+us had been around with spouses and SO.s before and were not
+uncomfortable. The folks were great and we enjoyed chatting
+and eating. It was a fun gathering but, It would be interesting
+to have conversations without the partners along.
The SO gathering this year placed 4.33 on the enjoyment scale,
with 6 of the 8 reported attendees evaluating. For any DLV
activity, that is quite respectable, and showed that it was
overall an enjoyable experience.
By our customs and precedents, Bob has "first refusal" rights
to do the featured SO gathering in 2010. There's nothing that
says there can't be two or more SO activities, coordinated by
Bob or by another, but is there a demand for more?
And then -- there's that request for a "couples" activity.
{Grab can of worms, walk in direction of can opener ...} :)
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
SO lunch and ideas:
Susan W (NZ) writes (first-person, no quoting):
With the SO lunch I was expecting to meet other SOs.
Us SO's are usually here because we support our mates
already. We don't need someone, no matter how well
intentioned, to tell us stuff (really!) and we don't
really want to ask questions or have the lunch focus on
TG issues. We could also consider an SO "big sister"-type
programme for new SO members. I have an SO buddy that I
really enjoy teaming up with.
Claim jumper was a great restaurant tho with food reasonably
priced and quick (we went back again before we left)
although its a little out of way if you don't have your
own private transport,. A car pool or meet on Strip
approach might work. Or somewhere close by to the other
lunch might be useful too.
Disappointing turnout from the SOs
. . . . .
For the Trevi meal, I personally enjoyed it a lot and I
liked the upstairs venue which we had pretty much to
ourselves, along with the stair down to the restrooms that
didn't take us thru the rest of the restaurant. I
wondered if we could add a couple of ideas tho. We could
use this as a "formal portrait" session given its just
prior to the limo tour (singles, groups). We could also
consider a few "awards" or prizes and possibly set the tables
up a little give Trevi is OK with that. I would be happy to
volunteer (Michelle organises the venue anyways so we can do
some stuff back home first).
Re the limo tour - I would rather spend half an hour in the
limo swigging champers and going past the hotels and sights,
than spend 20 minutes waiting for all the cars to arrive and
half an hour getting people back in.
Why not have a little more "free time" between each venue and
have a set meet up, then do the "Welcome to Vegas sign" and
later met up at a final venue?
Plus how could we miss the Four Queens and Fairmount
Experience? I liked that as much because we had some
time in the limo getting there to chat with our car group
and get to know a new person or two. I assume we pay the
limo by the hour and not by the mileage? We just drove
maybe four or five miles at best. What would also help is
a definite time of departure - we just seemed to wait too
long before we were off. If we could time things with the
Trevi meal so we minimise the waiting would be good too.
Talked long enuf.
. . . . .
Thanks, Susan.
Since you remarked about a disappointing turnout, let's review
the numbers surrounding the SO activity ...
The final master roster had 36 SOs signed up to attend DLV 2009.
Accounting for the usual expected fallout, that means you would
have between 25 and 30 SOs actually attending, most of whom
would be present during the time of the SO get-together on
Tuesday.
With a reported turnout of only 8, this means that the
activity captured less than 1/3 of the potential audience.
Why? I don't know. The SOs among us are probably more likely
to be able to speculate as to why.
One very unusual circumstance regarding the numbers here is
that we had only THREE actually signed up, at activity sign-up
time, to attend this activity. With 8 showing up, we had one
of our very few cases of reverse-fallout, where far more
actually showed up than signed up.
Bob had remarked to me just prior to DLV that he was concerned
about the low sign-up. I suggested to Bob that he circulate
at the opening mixer, catch the SOs, introduce himself, and
personally invite them to the SO luncheon. I think that's the
reason for the turnout greater than the sign-up.
Your idea of a "SO Big Sister" program sounds intriguing. The
only way we're going to find out if it's viable is to try it.
Let me ask you (Susan W.) this directly. Are you willing to
act as the "SO Big Sister" coordinator on such a program?
. . .
The idea of using the Forum fountain area or a setting
internal to Trevi for smaller group photos and individual
portraits might work well. The only way to know if it will
work is to try it.
I have mixed feelings about doing award presentations or
anything where we want a maximum audience at Trevi. From
the other comments, it appears that there are some major
issues that will have to be overcome to get an absolute
maximum turnout at Trevi, those being such things as the
degree of public exposure and the price.
Any ideas for getting a greater turnout at Trevi, anyone?
. . .
For the Limo Tour, what I was hearing after the LT in 2008
was that there was the desire for more riding time and
less standing-around time. That's one thing we tried for
this year, but as you know, there were challenges in
getting people loaded, moving, etc.
#include <herding_cats_analogy.h>
I'll bring up the concept of planned timed stops, but
rider-selected routes with the Limo Team.
The main reason we skipped Fremont St. this year is because
we had complaints about it last year, mostly arising from
confusion of the drop-off point, difficulty in getting
people re-assembled, and concerns about it being too
exposing for some. As JoAnn remarked, our skipping of it
this year only validated the need to include it.
Yes, limos are paid by the hour, base rate plus a fuel
surcharge. Meter starts running when all limos are present
and ready to load. We go into a rather steep overtime
situation if we run late, thus the decision to dismiss
the tour at Bellagio this year.
>Talked long enuf.
I think I have too. :)
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Activity discussion:
Please continue to discuss and recap ...
Vivian Chen writes:
>Regarding Trevi,
>It was a bit exposed due to the forum shops. That might have
>discouraged a few from attending. That said, the room we had
>upstairs offered plenty of privacy with quite a view of the
>forum shops. The price was reasonable considering the location
>of the venue.
Agree on both parts.
We did have one comment to the effect that Trevi in general
and the DLV group in particular were difficult to find.
I think of Trevi as being one of the most obvious places,
very conspicuous in the Forum complex, and difficult to
miss, actually.
Reading between the lines, I think this person may have
been a bit too shy to ask for directions and/or to ask
the host(ess) at Trevi where the DLV group was.
. . .
>Regarding the Limo Tour,
>I thought we were going to be dropped off at the place where
>our cars were parked. That wasn't the case.
True, and the drop-off at Bellagio was an option, depending on
timing, that we did not set in place until the LT was winding
down. We were running a bit tight on time, so we concluded it
at Bellagio.
The reason we asked people with vehicles to use the Caesars
casino valet was to shorten the walk should this option be
used.
>Walking from the Trevi fountain to our limos was a bit far
>of a hike in heels.
Yes, but trust me, we did not find a closer public entrance
which had access to the limo staging area.
>I was hoping for Fremont street but we skipped that one.
As JoAnn has remarked. Leaving it out this year only
validated the need to include it.
Next year we plan to list the planned stops on the sign-up
screen. We've talked about listing posisble stops and
letting those who sign up decide them by popular vote.
. . .
>Regarding payment system, Credit cards and internet
>transactions would be nice.
I think that using Glamour Boutique as a clearing house
will make DLV payments go more smoothly. Of course it
will be up to each individual activity coordinator to
use or not to use this method of payment.
Some coordinators in the past have accepted Paypal as
an option. I don't know if GB accepts Paypal for normal
business, but if they do it will probably apply to the
DLV payments as well, and if they do not, it won't.
. . . . .
Mary Beth writes:
Blue Ox:
>>I say that this activity, format, and vendor all deserve
>>consideration for a repeat in 2010.
>>Thoughts?
>No problem with using the Blue Ox again.
Anyone: Any negatives about the Blue Ox?
. . .
Final evening:
>>It will really be a group decision as to whether we go down
>>a different road for our ending evening this coming year
>I'd like to see the final evening event take place on
>Friday night, even if DLV lasts through Saturday.
>It seems that a lot of people leave on Saturday (admittedly,
>myself included), and it would be nice to have the "farewell"
>get together on Friday with Saturday shifted to an EON format.
Hmmmm .... interesting idea. On one hand we don't have
anything that says our "Ending Bash" absolutely has to
be on the very last evening.
On the other hand I hate to "sacrifice" a quality day in
deference to those who intend to bail early. My usual
approach would be to try to build up the final evening
to try to encourage those who might depart to stay.
. . .
Daily lunch:
>>Do we want to consider "anchoring" the daily lunch at a fixed
>>location again?
>I think that's a bad idea. I for one like to sample as many
>places as I can in Vegas. I definitely do not want to eat
>at the same place more than once during the week.
>Maybe the way to fix this is to use some non-casino restaurant
>options, e.g. Harley-Davidson Cafe, Hard Rock Cafe, Claim
>Jumpers, PT's, etc.
Although we've used casino buffets exclusively for the daily
lunch, we have no rule that says non-casino places can't be
used. The only way to find out would be to try them.
It will be up to those who volunteer to host(ess) the lunches
who make the call as to where.
. . .
Trevi:
>>(Trevi) ... where were the other 80-some in-town bodies?
>I think this is a combination of price and location. Trevi
>is out of some people's budget range, and many probably
>aren't comfortable walking through the Forum Shops to get
>there. Others possibly just aren't fans of Italian cuisine.
The more I think of this, the Forum complex is one of the
most "exposed" venues we used this year. I can imaging it
being scary for many who are new to public exposure. This
(fallout due to being too exposed) may be one limitation we
have to live with when planning future activities at Trevi.
. . .
Joe's:
>>Joe's was rated somewhat lower than the others, but
>>again, I didn't hear any specific complaints so I'm
>>not too concerned about it.
>The food was just ok, I didn't feel it was worth the $$$$
>prices they charged.
>Some of the waiters assigned to our tables seemed to be
>unhappy about dealing with us.
:(
I hope your tip, or lack of same, reflected the attitude.
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Activity and venue suggestions:
In completing our wrap-up of the 2009 event, we need to give
a good once-over to the comments and suggestions received on
the attendee survey.
Let's open up the topic of the general and specific activity
and venue suggestions which came in on the survey.
Please feel free to jump in here, comment, discuss, add
additional suggestions, or, better yet, volunteer to make
some of the suggested activities happen. :)
. . . . .
+More dancing options - Paris - Le cabaret' is usually
+good (last two years)
There were countless suggestions for this. All it takes for
this to happen is to have someone who is a fan of the Paris
Le Cabaret volunteer to coordinate the activity and work
out the details.
I have a feeling that Kimberly K will be jumping on this
one. :)
. . . . .
+Organizing a 'thrift shopping spree' with a van or something
+for group transportation would be a neat addition to the
+events IMNSHO.
We've had these before. Shopping activities typically don't
draw huge crowds, but they appear to be well-liked by those
who attend.
.. and ...
+Shopping at LV Outlet shops.
+Shopping at the north side shops
Thrift shopping, outlet shopping, mainline/mainstream shopping,
anything like that can be set up very easily. All it takes is
for one of us to "adopt" the project and work out the details
to make it happen.
We've had a couple "shopping crawl" things in the early days
of DLV, hitting everything from malls to the Fantastic Indoor
Swap Meet! I remember FOUR vans on a shopping thing one year.
Shopping trips typically are not very large in terms of the
number of people who show up for them, but they do tend to
be highly rated by those who participate.
. . . . .
+We should go see the Rocky Horror Picture Show!
I would love to see this happen, however I think the chance
of RHPS appearing in a regular theater during DLV next year
is extremely low. :( The last report I heard (ca. 2006) was
that every full-scale 35mm theater in Las Vegas had been
contacted and had turned down RHPS.
There may be a large-screen video showing going on in
Commercial Center. If anyone wants to check this out and
propose something, please feel free to do so.
. . . . .
+We need more strictly social just bull sessions in bars like
+we used to have back in the early 2000's.
Cat, one of our former regulars, used to use the expression
"Quality Social Time" to refer to such things as mixers,
happy hours, etc. A good example of what I think is being
referred to here would be this year's Sunday Pre-DLV thing
and the Welcome Celebration. These were both conducive to
social interaction.
I think we need a few large gatherings, each complete with
a good dose of that QST, over the course of DLV.
If there's a demand for it, a bar type mixer, either in a
mainstream or alternative venue, can be scheduled in just
about any timeslot.
. . . . .
+A Prom, for those of us to relive, where we had to once wear
+a suit or tux, let's now dress the way we really wanted to
+back then.
This appears to be along the same line as several suggestions
we had last year for some kind of upscale dress-up activity.
We discussed a large upscale dress-up affair including dinner
and QST. Nothing ever happened other than the initial round
of discussion.
We've had various dress-theme evenings at times over the
years, such as Red Shoe Night, Go Blonde Day, Secretaries
Night, Retro Night, etc. We could very easily do a prom/formal
night if there's the demand for it and, yes, you guessed it,
somebody takes on the project.
. . . . .
+I would like to see some kind of a couples get together
{sigh}
I don't know what to say about this one.
In general, I tend to oppose suggestions which exclude,
and in this case, many attendees (those without a partner
present) would be excluded.
Also, how is a "couple" defined? Is it an avowedly-het
genetic male CD and a cisgendered female spouse only, or
are more inclusive definitions to be used?
Yes, I know we have a long history of SO get-togethers, which
do indeed exclude. I believe this is enough of a special case
to warrant such an exclusive attendee base. We also do have a
very liberal definition of "SO", which usually includes such
things as male SOs, nontraditional SOs, and TG-TG couples.
If somebody wants to organize a "couples" thing, I'm not
going to try to stand in the way. However, I question if
this is a path we want DLV to be taking.
Instead of a "couples only, solo attendees not welcome" type
of thing, I would suggest planning something that would be
primarily of interest to those attending with a partner.
. . . . .
+Erotic Heritage Museum. Just opened. Groups of 10 or more get
+$10 off the normal $20 admission.
Uh, okay, I guess ... Anybody wanna check this out and propose
something? :)
. . . . .
+We went o Dave's BBQ to see Charles's new wife!
I can envision this as part of any multi-track evening.
Also a possible second-track against a feature activity.
For those who don't know what Famous Dave's is, it's a regional
BBQ chain from the upper midwest which has now gone national
and invaded Las Vegas.
Stacie, wife of Charles, of Charles Bar Fame, works at the
Famous Dave's at Blue Diamond Road and Arville. A bit off
the beaten path, but not totally out of the way.
All we need is for someone to "adopt" this one (Gina? HINT!)
for it to happen. :)
. . . . .
+Dancing - with suggestions from the local girls as to where
+are the good mainstream dancing locales.
and ...
+Need more dancing at clubs. I went off on my own to dance
+clubs.
.. and ...
+Rio Voodoo Lounge
All it takes to make it happen is ...
. . . . .
+Post- event or late night gathering at Beauty Bar on Fremont
+Street.
Once again. All it takes is for someone to volunteer.
. . . . .
+Dinner at Top of the World and Sushi Roku were both great, but
+definitely make for upscale events.
And again, anybody who wants to see this happen can make it
happen.
. . . . .
+That German restaurant by Glamour Boutiwue. A few of us
+walked down there and had a great meal.
.. and ...
+#1. Casino bat at Palazo.
+#2. Cafe Hiedelberg, German food.
+#3. Tony Romas, bar-be-q.
The casino bar at Palazzo (a bunch of us went there right after
Jersey Boys this year) would be good for an informal mainstream
get-together on any multi-track evening, or it could be some
kind of after-activity thing after something else in the same
general area, kind of like what we did after Jersey Boys.
I know we've done Tony Romas before, and I know that Cafe
Heidelberg is regarded as TG-friendly, so either would work
for any multi-track evening.
Any takers?
. . . . .
Almost as if the pendulum is beginning to swing back in
retrograde, we're starting to see suggestions of some of
our old favorite (??) alternative places as if they are
now new and uncharted territory ...
+I had breakfast one morning at IHOP and found myself
+visiting some of the local bars, like Spotlight, Badlands
+and Las Vegas Lounge. I also went back top PT's for lunch
+one day and was well received even without the group.
.. and ...
+I wennt to a club with a few local cd's called flex. It
+seemed nice and I felt safe there.
.. and ...
+We did go out on our own, but I am not sure I would risk
+recommending it as venue other than the drag show at Flex.
+Its free, fun and very open.
We've used Flex off and on since 2002, even having some of
the larger gatherings there at times. We've had several
small and medium gatherings at Spotlight. I don't think we
have ever had an activity at Badlands. (Where is this?)
Las Vegas Lounge is a prostitution bust just waiting to
happen! Enough said on that one.
I think that PT's, in particular the one on Sahara at
about 6th., has potential to be used for something more
than a pre-DLV thing.
+Stoplight Lounge. Nice little bar. We walked down there
+from dinner.
I assume this was intended to be Spotlight Lounge.
We hit bars like this on the Alternative Bar Crawl, but
there's nothing that says we can't have a small or
medium bar mixer type thing or happy hour in any of the
above.
Instead of a bar mixer, a special event at one of these
bars (karaoke, drag show, etc.) could be an option on any
multi-track evening. Maybe even a bar mixer followed by
karaoke or a show.
#include <all_it_takes_to_happen_is.h> :)
. . . . .
+Also, I went to Gardunos at the palms twice with a few other
+friends and had no problems there.
And once again, this would work for any of the multi-track
timeslots. All it takes is ... :)
. . . . .
+Power Exchange Thursday night
If somebody here wants to take on the duties of such an
activity, this can indeed happen. I know it's not for
everybody, but it appears to be very popular within the
TG community.
. . . . .
+The M Resort-Spa-Casino would be a great location for a
+great night out for Dinner/Dance/Gaming/Drinking/lodging.
+I went out there with a girlfriend dressed and had a greatest
+time with no problems what so ever. so much better than a low
+end with high priced drinks in a dive bar activity like
+goodtimes. OMG!!!!!!! And it's very TG friendly and an
+excellent venue and not at all pricey
I went to M shortly after it opened, mainly just to see what
it was like. It's a nice midscale very Station-ish casino and
hotel.
The only issue I see with M is that it's way out in the
middle of nowhere! It's a good 10 miles or more from the
main part of the Strip. That translates to a very expensive
taxi ride for those without a vehicle or a ride.
I somebody wants to organize something at M, please go
ahead, keeping in mind that the turnout may be affected
by the distance and location.
. . . . .
+Hard Rock Cafe and the Casino. I went with various groups
+of ladies 4 nights and we had great service. Used the ladies
+rest room NO PROBLEM at all even with a line. All the girls
+that went with me enjoyed the service food and acceptance.
+Hard Rock will have a NEW LARGE Cafe on the strip that will
+open this August. It will be the LARGEST Hard Rock cafe in
+the world. If any one wants me to arrange for a dinner or
+lunch for the Diva event next year just let me know and I
+WILL take care of it.
.. and ...
+I went to the Hard Rock Cafe with other crossdressers 3
+times, it was a very fun experience. The management was
+very supportive and welcomed us with open arms, the wait
+staff was very good to us. I highly recommend Hard Rock
+Cafe
The Hard Rock Cafe in Las Vegas has a rich history with DLV,
going all the way back to the very first event, DLV 1997!
We've had various small, medium, and large get-togethers at
the Hard Rock Cafe off and on over the years. We used it for
the Pre-Milanos happy hour this year. (Pinkfest, in Chicago,
also uses the HRC there regularly.)
If there's a new and expanded HRC in Las Vegas, all the better.
The only downside is that the music can be loud enough to
impede conversation.
Any HRC volunteers?
. . . . .
+Any chance that Amy will allow a plugged-in jam next year?
I don't know.
By tradition, Susan will have the "right of first refusal"
to coordinate the Jam Session in 2010. If Susan (or another
volunteer) wants this and can arrange for a place (GB or
elsewhere) which will allow amplifiers, yes, it can happen.
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
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