From: Michelle Jenkins (dlvdisc@geekbabe.com)
Date: Mon May 31 2004 - 13:47:59 CDT
Howdy everyone
> I've taken the liberty of adding some comments here and there. Your
> comments, observations, and interpretations are most welcome.
Kewl.....Goody...thats the best part!
> Attendance history:
>
> 25 stated DLV 2004 was their first DLV.
> 16 stated they had attended DLV once before.
> 24 stated they had attended DLV two times or more before.
How does this compare to the mix on the registration database...as to
whether the 65 respondents are indicative of the group as a whole?
> Travel distance:
>
> Approximate average travel distance was 2350 miles. Significant increase
> from 2003.
> Somewhat of a surprise to me, with the higher average travel distance,
> I assumed more would be flying.
I noticed that there seemed to be quite a few groups that had driven from
long distances, ie 3/4 sharing a car from the East Coast etc.
> Arrival date:
>
> Before May 1: 14
> Saturday, May 1: 9
> Sunday, May 2: 18
> Monday, May 3: 8
> Tuesday, May 4: 4
> Wednesday, May 5: 7
> Thursday, May 6: 3
> Friday, May 7: 2
> Departure date:
>
> Thursday, May 6: 4
> Friday, May 7: 10
> Saturday, May 8: 14
> Sunday, May 9: 18
> After May 9: 18
>
> Average number of days in attendance: 6.23, an increase from 2003. Over
> the past few years we've been seeing a trend toward more week-long
> attendees.
>
> Our people are coming earlier and staying longer. They must like it! :)
Well there has always been a clamouring for a longer DLV, the latter
comments by a few that it was too long, notwithstanding. I would only
comment that even though there may be no DLV activities on the two/three
days prior to and immediately after the official DLV, there should be
some nominated venues / times etc for these people to meet and do stuff
together. Especially if the early arrivers and later departers are an
increasing trend.
> Slight increase from last year. This has been creeping upward, more than
> one year of age per calendar year, since we have been tracking it. (I
> guess eventually I will get to the wrong side of this myself.) :)
Well as long as it keeps increasing you will remain on the lower side of
it one assumes? :-)
> . . . . .
> Public exposure:
>
> DLV 2004 was first public exposure: 1
> Less than one year: 6
> 1-2 years: 5
> 2-5 years: 17
> 5-10 years: 23
> 10-20 years: 7
> 20+ years: 2
> Does not apply: 4
I find it difficult to believe that ONLY 4 people have never exposed
themselves...in public! :-)
> Activities, enjoyment. 1-5 scale ...
>
> The skewing of these toward the high side is due to the fact, I believe,
> that most of them are indeed outstanding activities and the participants
> saw them as such and rated them as such.
>
Ummmm... It seems to me that rating here can be misleading. Since most
people go to thing they are likely to participate in and enjoy anyway the
chances of a good rating are pretty good to start with. Eg Golfers like
playing golf...end of story hence the high rating.
1 Golf 4.94 (16 responses) [MS]
2 High tea: 4.93 (14 responses, 3 no-shows) [MS]
3> NSD side trip: 4.91 (35 responses, 2 no-shows) [MS?]
4 Lake Mead cruise: 4.86 (14 responses) [MS]
5 Pity Party: 4.82 (17 responses) [CE]
6 Limo tour: 4.79 (28 responses) [MS]
7 MCC Church: 4.78 (9 responses) [MS]
8 Carluccio's dinner: 4.72 (39 responses, 2 no-shows) [CE]
9 Art tour: 4.67 (6 responses, 1 no-show) [MS]
10 Garden Party: 4.59 (25 responses) [CE]
11 San Remo: 4.56 (16 responses) [MS]
12 "V" show: 4.56 (16 responses, 2 no-shows) [MS]
13 Dance Night: 4.52 (21 responses) [MS]
14 Thrift shop tour: 4.5 (8 responses, 2 no-shows) [MS]
15 Star Trek Experience: 4.5 (6 responses) [MS]
16 Hard Rock Cafe: 4.49 (43 responses) [MS]
17 Milano's dinner: 4.46 (26 responses) [CE]
18 Lunch With/out Ginger: 4.42 (19 responses) [MS]
19 Annual Mixer: 4.39 (41 responses) [CE]
20 Hamburger Mary's: 4.39 (38 responses, 2 no-shows) [MS]
21 Welcome Celebration, Flex: 4.31 (35 responses) [CE]
22 Glamour Boutique: 4.31 (26 responses, 4 no-shows) [CE]
23 Farewell get-together: 4.31 (13 responses) [CE]
24 Rhyolite trip: 4.3 (20 responses, 1 no-show) [MS]
25 Charles Bar: 4.3 (10 responses) [MS]
26 Pre-DLV, Spotlight: 4.26 (27 responses) [CE]
27 Goodtimes karaoke: 4.24 (42 responses) [CE]
28 Freezone happy hour: 3.83 (23 responses) [CE]
29 Las Vegas Lounge: 2.17 (17 responses) [CE]
I do see some trends though based on a few other factors maybe.
7 of the top 10 activities are mainstream, 15 out of the top 20, while 7 of
the bottom 10 are Closed Environment. I believe that the group is enjoying
being out and about more than the closed environments of some of the clubs.
I know many will realise this is a little hobby horse of mine but I thing
the results do indicate a general liking for mainstream normal everyday (if
you can call anything in Las Vegas EVERDAY) activities.
Annie has also made some comments and has a slightly different few of
this, that even the lower rating is OK, given the higher average /
overall rating. Ignoring LVL as it was just a hole and Freezone,
probably because all it was, was really just a just meeting point and
nothing happened there, the others, as venue / activities were still
rated relatively lowly. The reason I suspect, is not the fact that they
were bars per se, but that they were bars at which we had no actual
activity, such as a meal or a show or theme (eg Pity Party).
I guess what I'm saying is that while we've previously had a call for
socialising time, simply putting bars on a schedule doesn't do it for a
lot of people. You can socialise and DO something, given the right
environment.
> The only thing that was disliked more than it was liked was the Las
> Vegas Lounge. I think it's quite obvious why this is the case.
As much as I thought this place was a dive, I think the NSD reception
party was general a none activity and it is as much that, that is
reflected in the survey results.
> Time crunch ...
>
> Seldom or never: 36
> Occasionally: 25
> Frequently: 4
>
> This is slightly higher than last year. As we increase the number of
> activities we plan, I think we will see this go higher.
Actually this year I only really hit the wall once, and that was after
an all nighter on Thursday / Friday morning. We over did the Thursday
withy Golf/ Show / Limo Tour / Charles Bar....etc. I think other made
comment on this as well.
> Comfortable being seen with group ...
>
> Most or all the time: 57
> Sometimes uncomfortable: 7
> Frequently uncomfortable: 2
>
> This, again, is a reflection of the overall climate of this year's DLV.
> The vast majority dressed and behaved in a manner that others were
> comfortable with in public.
This year I was very much more comfortable being with DLV as a group.
There was a lot less of the obvious flamboyance (or should this be
flamgirlance?) that has been seen in past years and was the cause of the
dress and behaviour code. The quality of makeup, style, deportment, hair
do's etc, etc was better (if not much better) that 2003.
There was that girl that kept showing up in a DLV T-Shirt... but get one
in every crowd! :-)
> Increased attention to behavior/dress/restroom issues ...
>
> Fine with it: 52
> Understand why it has to be: 12
> Don't like, but will put up with it: 1
I only heard / saw one person that objected to this in any obvious way
and she was told firmly to go read it. In my opinion her appearance and
attitude changed from last year and over the few days I did see her. For
a group with an average age in their fifties, male, female or mixed, the
fact that we have to have such comprehensive rules / guidelines, is an
unfortunate indictment on a few.
> Again, this says a lot regarding the climate and culture this year.
> . . . . .
> How much did the Mothers Day issue affect your plans:
>
> Little or none: 49
> Somewhat: 10
> Significantly: 5
>
> This also may be somewhat self-fulfiling, since I'm aware of a few
> people who did have Mothers Day issues who chose to skip the entire DLV
> this year rather than attend for what they could.
NOT Really. That fact that about 20% were affected is probably a
reflection on all of those on the list that might have come but didn't
for a variety of reasons. The only way to find out would be to survey
the mail list, for those that didn't come and ask why not.
> . . . . .
>
> Degree of structure:
>
> Fine as it is: 59
> Want less structure: 2
> Want more structure: 3
>
> Seclusion of activities:
>
> Fine as it is: 38
> Want less seclusion: 20
> Want more seclusion: 6
>
> Majority still says it ain't broke, however we're now seeing a number of
> those who desire more seclusion, as well as less.
If you look back DLV has changed in some ways over the last few years.
It is getting longer, it has having more mainstream activities and the
type of activity continues to be more adventurous (Eg NSD). There some
non partying mainstream stuff and it seems that these are quite popular.
Take the boat trip for example, this was both well supported and
enjoyed.
As the group (ie the average confidence level, not those of a leading
few) continues to gain confidence, there will be an increasing desire
for less seclusion but a continuing trail of people wanting more
seclusion until they've "caught up" so to speak. As anyone who has gone
from being a first timer to and experienced out and about DLVer will
tell you, its only the ultimate exposure like the boat trips etc that
make you realise that it can be done and the confidence levels grow
appropriately.
> Length of DLV:
>
> Just right: 44
> Too short: 12
> Too long: 7
>
> This is the first year we've had any significant reports of it being
> too long. The length may be catching up with us.
I don't think DLV was too long, just that stayed too long! :-)
> Name tags ...
>
> Found them helpful: 40
> Ok with them: 19
> Do not like: 4
>
> Again, if it ain't broke ...
Ummmm.... Got mine at Freezone, wore it there and at Milano's, put it in
my hand bag and never saw again until I was packing up to come home!
And from the comments....
> +I like to have one big event that we all can get dressed up ( like a
> +ball) and meet as many of the girls at one time. I can see that would
> +be hard with girls coming and going home every day
Ummm ... NSD?, Limo Tour? Show? Some of us dressed up!
> +I would like to see perhaps another round of golf at a different course
> +(2 days, 2 courses) and a ballroom dance venue for the DLV'ers
YES!!! A real person....Golf on two days!!!!
> +I think that possibly having an Evening of Dinner, Street Dancing, and
> +shopping on Fremont Street would be fun and low cost. An evening or day
> +trip to the Rio to see the Mardi Gras in the sky show would be fun as
> +well.
Good Idea's
> +I wanted to do the Limo Tour, but playing golf in the hot sun all day
> +and then trying to stay awake till 2am or more would have been a huge
> +effort for me as I am not a young person. Please let's discuss this
> +before next year comes and I'll do both. (Golf group average age was
> 50).
The Thursday schedule was demanding and I agree , having gone to the
golf, show and tour and Charles bar and breakfast at Bellagio the next
morning it was a long hard day!
> +I did find that the golf outing lunch was not all inclusive with the
> +payment of the golf. Also the seating arrangement of having those who
> +finished earlier sitting on top of the lounge and those finishing later
> +sitting at the bottom was rather a disappointment, I felt left out of
> +the party, only until I and my golf partner and 2 other girls picked up
> +chairs and included ourselves in the festivities. The planner had no
> +concept of bringing all those that played into her grasp.
Seemed like it was more an oversight than anything to exclude anyone. I
was surprised that we got the lunch / discount vouchers at all so I
guess it depends on the expectation.
> +This survey is to long.
It is a bit long.
> 1. Temperature. There's not much we can do about this. I'm not a
The week following DLV the temperature plummeted. I was there and it was
down into the 70-80's most days with maybe one day in the low 90's.
Seems like the week we were there may have been unseasonably warm,
compared to last year when the temperature was unseasonably cool! It was
warm though, made worse by the wind on occasions. Moving the week
earlier in the year won't necessarily help. You just have to remember
that Las Vegas is in the desert and it does get hot!
> 3. Restrooms. Overall, I would say that everybody present did an
> exceptional job in helping us to have zero significant incidents during
> DLV. The only case I can remember of any restroom difficulty is one
> person having to go very badly on a trip back from an activity where
> drinks were served. :)
Well two actually. Once coming back from NSD and once after the Limo
tour, while still with my group when we stopped for Burito's. I think it
was a quick call to the Cheers Bar next to Roberto's! Interesting!
> There was the issue at the Hard Rock, and I and the other ORG people I
I felt this was a little unfortunate. It not only affected our group but
impacted on all the GG's there as well. They should not have been
affected in that situation in my opinion. It seemed to be an HRC
decision as a result of a complaint by a girl to her parents about "us"
being in the ladies. Probably a good reason to avoid venues where
children are present!
> . . . . . . . . . .
>
> 4. Mainstream vs. alternative bars.
>
> Ya know, I don't think we will ever, as hard as we try, find one or two
> bars of any theme or any scale that 100 individuals will agree are
> ideal.
>
> Yes, this year, those who want more mainstream bars and fewer alternative
> bars have been vocal, far more so than in the past.
>
> I would think, however, that if this were indeed a calling from the
> Teeming Millions to eschew alternative bars and go entirely with
> mainstream bars, the activities in the alternative bars would be rated
> significantly lower overall. This does not appear to be the case. If we
> examine the enjoyment ratings for all bar activities, both mainstream
> and alternative, with two exceptions they are clustered between 4.2 and
> 4.5 with neither of the categories predominating.
>
> We did have two bar activities, both in alternative venues, that were
> clearly out of this cluster. First is the Las Vegas lounge, and our only
> activity to rate below 3.0 on the enjoyment scale. I think it's safe to
> say that we will not be going back there unless it changes
> significantly.
>
> The other one is somewhat of an enigma to me. That is the happy hour at
> the Freezone. It placed 3.8-something. 3.8x out of 5.0 is, IMAO, not
> bad per se, but all but two of our activities were in a cluster of
> 4.2 to 5.0, making this a clear exception.
Referring to my earlier comments, it's not the bars, its the lack of
theme, purpose that causes the problem. Freezone was more like one of
those registration activities. It was the first up for everyone who was
in LV at the time and wasn't really doing anything. IMO scheduding a bar
visit without a purpose is going end up with type of result in a survey.
> 5. One central hotel, group rates.
This isn't going to work. There are too many opinions on good / better
and best hotel in Las Vegas. IMO we should have hotels that are
geographically closer. The Sahara for example seems somewhat remote.
But.... People have there favorites and I can see the Sahara being
nominated every year. Having more rather than less? Not really sure that
will make much difference either.
Seemed to be more doing the suite and timeshare thing this year with
lots of positive comments.
> . . . . . . . . . .
>
> 7. Smoke and smoking.
Build a bridge. Get over it! Smokers smoke and in Las Vegas its seems to
be deemed very acceptable. I think the choice of the dive neighborhood
bars makes it worse than say the large open casino bars etc.....
> 8. Charles Bar.
>
> Yes, we probably should have stated that "Charles Bar" was not really
> the name of the bar, and that Allegro (Allegra?) was indeed the name of
> the bar to look for.
This was complicated by the incorrect bar name AND the fact that Charles had
actually moved to a bar round the corner anyway.
We are officially? (unoficially?) known as Charlies Angels to the rest of
Charles colleagues. Well done girls!
Hugs
Michelle
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