From: kumiko yvonne watanabe (dlvdisc@geekbabe.com)
Date: Thu Oct 02 2003 - 15:47:49 CDT
I have a few concerns....
>I do not want to offend anybody on the organizing committee but....
Who or whom is in this 'committee' you are refering to?
>I am convinced the DLV organizing committee reached a decision on not
>what is best for DLV
What is your 'best for DLV' ?
>I am convinced the DLV organizing committee reached a decision on not
>what is best for DLV but what was convenient for 15 members of the
>organizing committee. If the goal of the organizing committee is to
>slow growth, and in fact shrink attendance, these dates are
>outstanding!
This is a very sarcastic negative remark to make, after the dates have
been set.
You are accusing others (15) who voted of organized malicious intent on
planning to slow down the growth of dlv. Where's your proof?
We could have used your 'expertise' and 'insite' when deciding what
dates for dlv. Where were you during the discussions?
If you were late in joining because of work or pc problems, then its
your fault.
You have no right to blame those that voted on the dates that were
presented, and took part in the decision process, accusing them of
intent, without showing some sort of proof of your accusations.
Those that votes could have just chose a date (dates stated by anyone
during the discussion phase), that works the best for themselves. Whats
wrong with that? How does this become a conspiracy?
>I am offended by some of the responses of those on the committee. I
>have never felt more disenfranchised with a group that I felt so very
>close to just a few months ago. Regarding the responses of "focus on
>the positives", I find this simply a cop out. It's nothing more than a
>cop out to stifle the discussion. But when a discussion has occurred and
>responses from the committee is such as "shut up and deal with", it's
>very discouraging. Why not just be honest and say "your opinion doesn't
>matter, go away".
Discussion is what it is, an open forum, where everyone has a chance to
speak their mind, making good or bad comments. Everyone's opinion
matters and Annie has stressed this from the very beginning, and has
worked hard to keep this forum quite open, and presented everyone's
comments to everyone.
You are doing what you just complained about...calling other people's
concerns about 'focus on the positives' as a 'cop out'. You are saying
to these people's concerns as 'your opinion doesn't matter, go away' and
'shut up and deal with it' because you are offended by it.
What is your solution?
What exactly do you mean by 'cop out'?
You are also saying to everyone to 'shut up and deal with' the problem dates.
>When you try to twist peoples opinions and concerns into something they
>are not, it is a simple attempt to avoid the discussion. Same thing
>goes for the "you don't like it, start your own" comments. It's nothing
>more than a cop out to stifle the discussion.
Everyone will get a slightly different interpretation and understanding
of what someone wrote. Mis-understanding what was written is quite
possible, because of the way it was written, and the interpretation can
be a honest understanding of what was written and NOT twisting someones
opinions and concerns. Understanding what what was written would be
mostly the same for everyone or different for everyone. How is this an
attempt to avoid the discussion?
You again are doing the same thing you are complaining about, twisting
peoples opinions with your view (cop out - avoid discussion) of what
they are saying. That opinion or concern "you don't like it, start your
own" may have originially meant something else (other than a cop out)
that is related to the discussion, or else why add it to that
discussion?... and NOT an attempt to avoid the discussion.
What makes your view on this the only correct one?
Comments by those that said this?
>What people are voicing are not negatives but concerns.
OK, they state their concerns.
Some are positive, but when there are concerns, it tends to be negative
(contray to what you state) as in something wrong or issues that need to
be addressed that wasn't earlier.
Then the issue becomes: What do we do then about their concerns?
Do we:
Keep the focus and expand and concentrate on criticism and negative comments?
Attack everyone and have everyone discouraged and have bad feelings and
attitudes?
Do nothing and just have everyone complain about the organizers of any
event, about everything that event is disagreeable to them, in their
world?
Provide no positive alternatives or changes and provide just negative
comments or problems?
You have stated that trying to improve things and positively better
events to make them more enjoyable is WRONG because 'focusing on the
positive is a cop out'!
In fact positively changing the dates away from Mother's Day weekend
would also be wrong to you, for the same reasons.
>I think the organizing committee will come to regret these dates.
I'm sorry, but those trying to plan dlv activities are only human, and
in this case of the dates, may not have made this decision to everyones
liking, and will probably make mistakes in the future. They will learn
from the mistakes, re-evaluate, make adjustments and move on, learning
from their mistakes.
This is a voluntary organization that will make mistakes, no group is
perfect, nor can it please everyone all the time.
It also sounds like you have judged and condemned dlv as guilty, as if
its an absolute truth that dlv is already a failure by your standards of
dates. It is very regretable that you feel that way.
Others who ARE going to dlv 04 and ARE currently planning events for dlv
04 are trying hard to maintain more optomistic and positive thoughts,
and attitudes, and are trying to do their best to make dlv an enjoyable
event for everyone who attends. They WILL overcome whatever problems
come up in the planning.
.... And most of all these people WILL MAKE dlv 04 a GREAT event!
To them, I will give my greatest appreciation and thank you for the
thankless job that they do. Plus a few galiano shots if they want it
also!
These people (unlike your opinion) will take these concerns as positive
things and make positive changes and corrections to their events that
they are planning to make it better and more enjoyable to those that can
make it to dlv.
>I've been part of an organizing committee within my company.
OK. Let's see YOU put your experienced walk to your talk, and put your
name down and start getting involved in planning NEW activities to make
DLV to more of what you feel should be the right thing to do to make DLV
better.
I would like to see how spectacular your continued planning of events at
every dlv each year will be, having 65%+ of all dlv attendees in
attendance.
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